Employment Law at 11 - HR’s role in Addressing Domestic Abuse - 5th July 2024

Posted in : 'Any Questions' Webinar Recordings on 9 July 2024
Legal Island
Legal Island
Issues covered: Domestic Abuse and safeguarding the well-being of employees

As HR professionals, safeguarding the well-being of our employees is a paramount responsibility. Unfortunately, domestic abuse is an issue that affects many, and its repercussions often extend into the workplace, impacting productivity, morale, and overall health. The PSNI recorded over 33000 domestic abuse incidents last year, an increase on the previous 12 months. It is essential HR makes a positive impact by fostering a supportive workplace culture.

In this special edition of Employment Law at 11, Seamus McGranaghan from O’Reilly Stewart and Lindsay Harris from ONUS join Julie Holmes from Legal Island to discuss this topic. Lindsay sets out the practicalities and Seamus provides his legal insights to help you:

  • Identify the subtle indicators that a colleague may be experiencing domestic abuse.
  • Gain practical strategies to support employees dealing with domestic abuse, ensuring their safety and well-being at work.
  • Understand how to create a compassionate workplace environment that prioritises the mental and physical health of all employees, while staying within the law.
  • Our expert speakers provide guidance to help you handle these sensitive situations with empathy and effectiveness.

 

Recording:

 

 

Transcript:

Julie: Welcome to our webinar today. It's "HR's Role in Addressing Domestic Abuse". My name is Julie Holmes and I'm part of the Knowledge Team here at Legal-Island. Today's discussion is about a crucial and sometimes overlooked topic: the impact of domestic violence on the workplace and how employers can effectively support employees.

If this is your first time joining us, we have Seamus, who is a regular on Unemployment Law at 11. Seamus McGranaghan is Director at O'Reilly Stewart in commercial, education, employment, and licensing law.

Our subject expert today is Lindsay Harris, and Lindsay is the Policy and Training Manager from ONUS, a domestic abuse not-for-profit organisation, which was established by Women's Aid in 2007. ONUS has helped organisations to become accredited safe places, and she's going to be talking to us a little bit about that later on, with over 2,000 safe places now across Ireland.

Our discussion is going to cover several key areas today, including employer support, Safe Place accreditation, and the legislative landscape as well in Northern Ireland.

If you have any questions, please drop them into the question box, which is over on the right-hand side, and we'll try and get through as many as we can.

I'd also like to thank our sponsors, MCS Group, who sponsor all of our webinars and podcasts. MCS helped people find careers that match their skill sets perfectly. They also support employers to build high-performing businesses by connecting them with the most talented candidates in the marketplace. If you're interested in finding out more about how MCS can help you, then please head to www.mcsgroup.jobs.

So, my trusty assistant today, Gosia, if you could bring up our first poll question for us today, please. What we're going to do is take a look at your organisation and whether you currently have an up-to-date domestic abuse policy. Vote for yes or no, please, with that.

I can see the votes are coming in, so Gosia, whenever you're ready to share the results. It just takes a second.

All right. So, we were talking about this actually earlier on. Seamus, I think you, in particular, were saying that you're not aware of many organisations having a policy in place. And Lindsay is going to give us some tips on that, so you can tune in and we'll find out more about that in just a moment.

The next question then is, "Do you currently provide all your staff with domestic abuse awareness training?" So not specialist training, but do people know what domestic abuse actually is, how you can spot the signs of it, what you need to do, and maybe what to stay away from as well? So again, if you can vote for us as well, please, on that. Your options are yes or no.

We were talking again today about how it's gaining a little bit more awareness within the workplace environment, and we just want to find out how much different organisations are doing. So Gosia, whenever you're ready, and we'll get the results up in just a moment. All right. Again, high percentage of people not delivering awareness training at the moment, and we'll see if after today we can change your minds on that.

So, our last question then, and Gosia again, just whenever you're ready, is if you would like more information on Legal-Island's all-staff training course. You can mark yes or no for us. What we will do then is be in contact with you where you can get in touch and have a free demo of our new eLearning.

It is just a brand-new eLearning course. It's called Domestic Abuse Awareness. Because it's an overlooked issue, this course will provide your staff with practical knowledge and advice on how to recognise domestic abuse, the impact of it at work, and the resources and support available to people.

With the introduction of the Domestic Abuse (Safe Leave) Act pending, employers in Northern Ireland do have a duty to offer at least 10 days' paid leave for victims of domestic abuse, and it's something that you can prepare for.

If you want further information, as I said, or to get a free demonstration on behalf of your organisation, you can email Debbie Wilson directly via debbie@legal-island.com. And as I said, that just has launched for us now. So, I think what we need to do, first of all, is really set the scene. So, Seamus and Lindsay, you're both very welcome and thanks for joining us this morning.

Seamus: Good morning. Thanks.

Lindsay: Good morning. It's a pleasure.

Julie: Thanks. All right. So, Seamus, first of all, I mentioned there about the Safe Leave Act, but can you set the scene for us and tell us what's going on?

Seamus: Well, we don't have a great legislative bank in relation to domestic abuse. That's the basic position. Now, things have improved a lot, but if we look sort of at the other jurisdictions around us, if we look across the water to GB, England, Wales, and Scotland, and if we look down south as well, there have been various developments in relation to domestic abuse.

So, the legislative framework here is . . . I mean, we always have to start with our sort of Health and Safety Act that we have here and the implications that that has on the workplace and the general protections that it provides. But when we think about health and safety in the workplace, we don't necessarily think about issues around domestic abuse. What we do think about is accidents in the workplace and health and safety issues around maybe things to do with gas leaks and those things that cause difficulties for employers.

But when you read the legislation, and it is so broadly drafted, there's no doubt that as part of the employer's requirement to provide a healthy and safe place to work, it does encompass issues that could arise around domestic abuse. And I think oddly enough, as life has developed and technology has developed, the scope of the abuse happening in the workplace or at the workplace is much greater now than what it would've been previously.

If the domestic abuse was happening in a domestic setting, if it was happening at home, there was the ability for employers to say, "Well, look, that's a home matter. We don't want to get involved". And that could be even the natural response to that. But what we have now is that technology has brought parties so much more close, and the ability to harass and to create serious difficulties for an individual whilst they're at work, even though their perpetrator is not present, is so much greater with social media. So, it's the apps, it's the messaging, and it's the ability to send videos and the threatening nature of all of this that can happen.

So, there are issues that can arise in work, and you need to be prepared as the employer. You need to be prepared to deal with those. And the preparation in relation to that is you need to have a policy and procedure in place. You need to be reactive to it. You can't take the person by the hand and bring them to the door and say, "I'm really sorry about all of this. I feel really bad. Good luck and all the best". The legislation will not cover you for that.

The good news about the legislation is that we have had really good, strong, up-to-date legislation that's been brought in 2021 under the Domestic Abuse and Civil Proceedings Act. Prior to that, we were kind of relying on really old, arcane legislation going back as far as the Offences Against the Person Act in 1861. So, we've now got this Domestic Abuse Civil Proceedings Act brought in 2021, and it's the legislation that criminalises things like coercive and controlling behaviour.

That brings Northern Ireland into line with the other jurisdictions in GB and in Ireland then as well. And it also brings us in line with our human rights standards that we have that come with our Human Rights Act. But that was a positive piece of legislation that came into place, and it's put us right up there front and centre. But where we really wanted to get to was, we had in 2022, there was a bill that was introduced in the Assembly, Domestic Abuse (Safe Leave) Act. Now, Lindsay will maybe give us some more information in and around this.

But the legislation there that was brought in has received Royal Assent. Everything is set up and ready to go. I suspect that the problem has been with the legislation, that we had our political issues arising at Stormont, or we didn't have an Assembly. We're now back up and running again in the Stormont because we got that position that the big black hole that was there in relation to those number of years.

I think this legislation, although it's very important legislation, had probably been pushed back when those famous words that all of our MLAs said about their in-trays being full and working to capacity. But the legislation is important and it's really important that this legislation is pushed and that we get it through.

The benefits of the legislation, and this is the first jurisdiction where this would be brought into line, would be that it would entitle employees who are victims of domestic abuse the right to avail up to 10 days' of paid leave a year. And this is called Safe Leave. It's a brilliant piece of legislation, but what we need to do is we need to get a push through the door in relation to it.

There are other bits and pieces that are involved in the legislation as well. Labour Relations Agency, in anticipation of the legislation back in 2022, produced a guidance, and the guidance is excellent. It's digestible, it's readable, and it's informative.

But what we need now is we need the legislation pushed through. And I suspect that that will come along, whether it will be in this year or whether it'll be into next year. Maybe now that we've got the selection out of the way for our MPs, that will move things along as well locally for us too. But hopefully, we can get things up and running.

So, what I'd say about the legislation is essentially we've had a very bad period of no legislative provisions whatsoever. The downside of it is significant, but the benefit of it is that we've been able to sit back and watch what has happened in the other jurisdictions. We've been able to learn from the steps that have been taken over there. And what we've been able to do is produce legislation that would be at the forefront and leading the way in relation to this important issue.

Julie: Thanks, Seamus. And I think it's interesting that, as you say, that's 10 fully paid days.

There was legislation brought in, in Ireland, last November, was it? And was it five paid days?

Seamus: I think so. It's five days there. So, this is double the amount of days, then, as well for us in our jurisdiction.

Lindsay can talk to the statistics much better than I can in relation to this. I mean, the guidance that is there talks in and around. If you look back at whenever the bill was brought and the consultation around the bill and stuff like that as well, they talk around this figure of something along the lines of 32,000 domestic abuse victims in 2021.

And everybody will be aware and clear that that's only the element of those victims that report matters. There's a much larger significant part that do not report matters. So, we can see the importance of the matter.

And maybe later on we'll get talking about the male and the female aspect of it and things like that. Christine and I have been on probably for the past two podcasts where we've had discussions going, "This also affects men".

But for this, I think the reality for domestic abuse is the majority and the predominant issue is for women, and we rightly need to put it in that context.

Julie: Great. And you've led us in nicely, Seamus, because Lindsay is going to . . . Gosia, if you could bring up that slide for us, please that Lindsay provided. It actually has some statistics for

us. And I don't know if you saw, Lindsay, there was an article in Personnel Today this week, and it was talking about the fact of the Euros, so the sports events, and that one in five people may be experiencing abuse. So, if you could talk us around that as well as the statistics to start us off, that would be great. Thank you.

Lindsay: Yes, if we look at this graph, I think that it tells its own story, but we can see when there are spikes with regards to reporting of domestic abuse incidents.

And as Seamus has rightly pointed out, we are aware of over 33,000 incidents last year, but that is the tip of the iceberg because we know that only approximately about a third of people will report their worst experience to the police. Interestingly, about 7% of people will report their worst experience in the workplace, but that's why we're all here today. But going back to looking at this graph, what we see here is we are likely to be entering peak time for domestic abuse incidents to be reported.

Now, whenever we are talking about the incidents that are being reported, and as Seamus has pointed out, until the new legislation was introduced. It came in, in '21 and was implemented in February 2022. We're still in the very early days of that new Coercive Control legislation, as it's come to be known, being implemented.

But the vast majority of incidents that we would probably see whenever we do look at police incidents would still tend to be that violence against the person crimes that are committed. So, they would still tend to dominate. However, what I would say is I believe we're in a bit of a time of transition whenever it comes to our understanding of domestic abuse.

This new legislation was very important in making that point. That is because we know that domestic violence or domestic abuse is about much more than the physical or the sexual tactics that are used within that relationship. That's just a subset of coercive control. I want you to think of coercive control as this umbrella, and under that umbrella, you will have lots of different tactics. You will have the physical abuse and you will have sexual abuse, which are probably the most tangible forms and the ones that we're most familiar with, because they're the most public. They're the ones that go to court and we tend to hear about currently.

However, we have emotional and psychological abuse. And that would arguably be amongst the most harmful forms of abuse. Certainly, whenever you are with individuals who have been in abusive relationships, they would say, "These are the ones that leave the deepest scars. These are the words that I can't unhear decades later". So those are the ones that people really struggle with and cause tremendous long-term harm. As Seamus has outlined as well, domestic abuse is keeping up with the times and we are also dealing with a lot more virtual and technological abuse. One of the things that always amazes me is by the time I work out how to use technology, people who are going to misuse it have been misusing it for some time. And it's taken us some time to catch up with it.

Whenever we think about it coming into the workplace, things like spyware. Spyware is very cheap and easy to put onto somebody's phone. And it could be a work phone. So as Seamus says, it does follow you into the workplace. It could quite literally be following you into the workplace because you could be recording everything or watching everything that that person does, even if they're not with you. But this is what we know about coercive control and the harms. There are a very wide range of tactics that are used, and they will continue whether that person is in physical proximity to that person or whether they're away from them. That is the point of coercive control. They're getting that message that it doesn't matter where you go, you are not beyond my control.

That's a very important thing we have to understand about domestic abuse. It is about control. It is about getting and sustaining control. That person knows that it doesn't matter where they are, if they're in work, if they're in church, or if they're in the shops, they are regulating their own behaviour because of this constant surveillance, because of this constant monitoring, because they just never know when that person may be watching them or may be holding them to account for behaviours that they expect of them.

As Seamus has said as well, it can, and it does happen to anyone. So, it doesn't matter what age you are, it doesn't matter what gender, it doesn't matter what sexual orientation you are. And it's also not just between partners or former partners. It can also be between family members. Now, there is a subset of people we are missing at the minute. There is a very important message that we need to get out. If you're experiencing harm from another family member, that's domestic abuse. That can potentially be very dangerous and even fatal domestic abuse. So, you need to know that there is that support available for you.

I think another thing we have to be very aware of, especially in the workplace, is that post-separation abuse is a very real thing. Sometimes we think if someone has come out of a domestic abuse relationship, that's it. Happy days. Done and dusted over. Unfortunately, that couldn't be further from the truth.

So, first of all, that point of separation can be a very dangerous time for an individual, especially if we're looking at that from the coercive control perspective. If that person who is obsessed with having control loses control, then they feel that they have lost everything.

And at that stage, abuse might escalate either to frighten that person into going back into the relationship or to destroy that person for defying their control and for leaving that relationship.

So, separation can be a time of particular risk whenever it comes to supporting individuals. And again, that's a key message that we would want to get out there.

Julie: All right. Thanks very much for that, Lindsay. And I like the fact that you've covered that we tend to . . . I know that women would tend to be the majority of people experiencing abuse, but that we can't leave out other groups. Seamus, you were actually talking about this a little bit before we started the webinar, and it was about the fact that as employers or as HR professionals, we may be a bit reluctant or a bit scared about where to get involved.

We've already had a question in about what if somebody's working from home and it may be that the person is experiencing abuse actually at home during work hours and such. So those are all different aspects that we need to look at. And then I think, Lindsay, you've brought in the technological aspect as well about how people can be stalked and, again, work devices used too. So, Seamus, why do you think that employers are reluctant, or how do we almost plan for that? Because there are a lot of sensitive areas that we have to deal with as HR.

Seamus: Yeah, it's one of those pieces I think that is naturally uncomfortable for everyone to deal with. And certainly, the issue of working from home, the legislation and the guidance from the Labour Relations Agency as well really records the fact that for any victim of domestic abuse, it was only ever going to get worse if they were working from home and they were at home with their perpetrator in relation to the abuse that was happening. But what we do know, and the legislation and the case law is very clear, is that when you're working from home, it's an extension of your place of work. So, the legal liability for the employer will extend to that period of time.

Now, we were sort of talking about transitions. We're in that transition period now where hybrid working really has set in. If people are working hybridly, they tend to be working a couple of days a week at home, and they are in the office for maybe one or two days after that. But really, it bears the issue around having a clear policy and procedure in place. Amongst the policies and procedures in place, what is essential is that there has to be training in relation to the policy and procedure. And I think then it's the next step after that, there has to be that ethos that comes out of the training.

You have to be putting your foot forward as an organisation to say, "Look, this is what our position is. We want an open-door policy. We want the ability for people to feel comfortable to come and make disclosures if they want to do that". Lindsay made a really good point earlier on just when we were chatting, and I'll not say too much about it because it's important that Lindsay sort of speaks on it, but it's that aspect as well that you're not running around looking for problems and overstepping your mark on these issues as well.

But I think the starting point, and we say this probably in every single webinar that we do, is policy and procedure. Really fortunate that the Labour Relations Agency's guidance has a draft precedent policy and procedure that you can work from, you can amend, and you can tailor for your specific organisation. But if you have the policy and procedure in place, that should put in the stepping stones for you as an HR adviser or another colleague in the workplace to help to address some of the issues, and addressing them in a reasonable, calm, and a manner that is going to assist and not going to deter somebody from making disclosures, or even intimidate the person or make them even more fearful than what they might be.

 So, I think it's very important that there's an acknowledgement that these are tricky, uncomfortable issues, but if there's a policy and procedure in place, if there's training that is being provided . . .Lindsay's organisation provides training for organisations and are the experts in relation to doing so. There are other organisations out there, of course, that can assist, but it really is about bringing these matters to the front.

And if you look back on the poll and those numbers of polls, I'm sure that's probably nothing new for Lindsay whenever she sees the polls, because it isn't the matter that comes around. Certainly, from my experience over 20 years in practice, as I said earlier, I can count on my hand the amount of times I've had to deal with a domestic abuse issue. What I could say is that it is absolutely happening every day of the week probably in most office places. You just don't hear about it. Or people are aware of colleagues in work where they have concerns, where it's maybe even being discussed at a management level, but there's that reluctance to involve and to step in to do anything about it. I think that those are the sort of natural human responses to it, but you can't ignore it. The legislation is there.

From a legal perspective, and this will be probably far away from any concerns that Lindsay would rightly have, but for the employer, there are risks there of employees leaving because they don't feel heard in the workplace or because somebody has approached the issue in the wrong way, and they feel that they have to leave. And you know what the position is at the moment. You have a long-standing member of staff, who's skilled, experienced, that you really count on and depend upon that you're potentially going to lose.

And there's a risk of potential claims if it's not dealt with in the appropriate manner as well. Even to a point where if an employee comes and makes a disclosure and it's not dealt within the appropriate way, and they leave and bring a claim for constructive dismissal, or they say, "There was no policy and procedure in place to help me at work. And in actual fact, it's indirectly discriminatory because as a result of my gender, as a female and this is happening to me, I'm being treated less favourably than my male colleagues".

So, there are implications for employers to really consider and be careful and aware of, which is why I think we need to have a clear written down policy and procedure and a go-to guide. But the procedure is never enough. You need to have the training and you need to have the ethos running through the employer's operations as well.

Julie: Seamus, I think that was great about making sure that it was inclusive. And Lindsay, I know that, for example, you provide. I know that Seamus has mentioned the LRA guidance, Safe Home, Safe Work, which is excellent, and there is guidance in there that anybody can take a look at. But you also provide more specialist support in actually helping an organisation develop a policy.

Lindsay: Yes, I love a good policy. I am all about a good policy. We have worked with employers for the past 16 years. We developed a workplace charter on domestic abuse, and we would work with organisations to help them attain that charter. So right from the policy stage. And the policy stage is very important. We have a number of very good policies ourselves that some of the organisations that we have worked with The Northern Ireland Civil Service, we've worked with them. They have a workplace charter. And we have worked with a very wide range of local councils. We have worked with PSNI. We have worked with the Northern Health and Social Care Trust.

But we have also worked with hairdressers who maybe employ about five people. And we will work with any organisation so that they can develop a workplace strategy that works for them.So, for the bigger organisations, absolutely policy. For the smaller organisations, maybe it's a policy statement or Seamus has mentioned that ethos. It's actually in the Labour Relations Agency's and I think their language is excellent in it. They talk about developing a psychologically safe place.

So as Seamus has said, it's not about us all turning into Miss Marple and going out there and rooting out domestic abuse wherever it is. Very often people would say to me, "How do I spot the signs?" And I would always say, "Do you know, it's not about spotting the signs. It's about saying, 'I'm a kind, compassionate person. This is a kind, compassionate workplace. And if you want to access support through our workplace, then we are here to help you do that'".

There are concerns, as Seamus has said as well, that people are frightened of overstepping. And I think an awful lot of the work we do is in reassuring employers and saying, "This is not about bringing additionality to your role. This is about you recognising where you can integrate your support with the sector experts and provide a much better holistic, all-around support for your employee".

Whenever we are looking at physical risk in the workplace, and Julie, I know that you mentioned stalking and there's been new legislation that has come recently about that. That is high-risk behaviour, and that is something we want to make sure that we are getting right. So, we would also work with employers to recognise where the limitations and boundaries of their role are, and whenever they really do have to engage with sector experts to ensure that their employee is kept physically safe in the workplace.

There are an awful lot of things that employers can do. You can change hours, you can change location, you can maybe allocate a parking space close to the building. There are an estimated one in three employees who have experienced domestic abuse. Those statistics come from Vodafone research. So, one in three, and of them, 94% of them said that the domestic abuse impacted negatively on their job.

As Seamus said, we do know that there are people who are either quitting their job through maybe coercion, or having to leave their job, or maybe losing their job every year because of domestic abuse, because of the impact of it maybe making them late for work, maybe making them absent, maybe making them take sick leave frequently. And for that employee to think, "I can't tell them what the real reason is", so they then lose their job, that's the last thing we want for someone who's living with domestic abuse.

We want them to have access to an independent income, because if they lose their financial independence, that's another form of dependence on the abuser. And that's what the abuser wants, so that's the last thing we want for our employees. We want to be able to support them to keep their job and to rebuild their life. And that is a very important role that employers can do. They can quite literally just be that safe place for employees.

We know as well from the Vodafone research that over 70% of employees said they felt safer in the workplace than they did at home. And that's because they can maybe look at a website or they can maybe make a phone call. They can access the support that they can't access at home. So maybe even having posters and cards. We have the Safe Place, this is the wee Safe Place logo. We have the cards. Having these about the place is maybe all you need to do for your employee to know that they can access that support. But there are additional steps, and we're happy to work with employers to help them realise . . .

Very often what you find is you will have supports in, but there maybe this policy and that policy and the other policy. It's just about bringing all those supports together in the one document, that you have a go-to document, and that you can outline what support is available so that expectations are managed between employer and employee, and they know what is realistic in terms of the support that they can get through the workplace.

Julie: I think that's a great point, Lindsay. Very much so. And I like the fact that you mentioned you can have five employees and you can still have a policy because all you're doing is saying, "We're a supportive environment". The one thing I liked about the Safe Place accreditation that ONUS work on with employers . . . and you also work with a much wider group. You work with community groups. You work with churches. Can you say just a little bit about that for us, please, about what that entails? What does that mean?

Lindsay: Yeah, absolutely. So, my previous role, I worked with Women's Aid before I was with ONUS. Before that, I actually worked with the School of Communication in Jordanstown. And Safe Place has always been about communication. It's very important for me that we have that sign. What that Safe Place logo means is if you're experiencing abuse, you will never be on your own. And somebody may walk past that 5 or 10 times every day, whether it's in their workplace, whether it's in their church, whether it's in the community group, but what we want people to see right across their community is we understand domestic abuse. We understand we're not the experts, but we know where the experts are, and we can get you to them. So, it is very much about making that statement, "We will support you if you want to access the support organisations that are out there".

So, it can be a place where you can walk in. If, for example, the only place you can get out to is to drop your children at school, we work with schools that are Safe Places. And we have worked with schools who have brought Women's Aid in to support a parent who is dropping her child at school because that is the only time, they can actually get away by themselves. So, it's about providing access across the community and us working together on a coordinated safeguarding response to domestic abuse, and recognising where we play our part, how we play our part, and how we can effectively respond to absolutely anybody out there who is experiencing domestic abuse. Because it can and does happen to absolutely anybody.

Julie: Thank you, Lindsay. Seamus, I was going to ask you about almost the HR side of it in relation to confidentiality, which Lindsay has covered partially, but in relation to record-keeping. I know that HR, if the Safe Leave does come into effect, the first questions will be, "Where do we keep that record? Who do we tell? Who do you share information with within the organisation?"

As Lindsay said, you can give somebody a parking space close to the door to make sure that they're safe, but should you be letting security know so that if somebody comes to the workplace that shouldn't be there? Again, just around that, if you could talk to us, please.

Seamus: Well, I think the key part has to be that there needs to be a trust and there needs to be a relationship of trust between the employee and the employer. I think that's probably the first step in relation to dealing with the matter. The employee needs to feel comfortable. The employee needs to also feel as if they're going to be treated normally, that they're not going to be highlighted to others for others to ask questions about and things like that.

But the confidentiality side of it is obviously very important. I mean, you're essentially going to be dealing with somebody that is very vulnerable, and there are going to be issues around trust. It's about reassuring, and I think providing that reassurance . . . Really important point that Lindsay has made is knowing your place and your boundaries around it as well. I think it's not a matter for you to get overly involved. And it's about sharing the issue, but doing that where you've had, I think, a very clear communication and discussion with the employee so that you're not taking any steps that they're not aware of.

So, if you are making other people aware or you're giving information within the organisation, you're explaining to the employee, first of all, that that's what the intention would be. I don't think you necessarily have to wait for their consent in all circumstances, but if you can have that discussion with them, make them aware, and if they put up objections in relation to it, you give the value to those and you give them consideration.

And I think after that, then there's the whole GDPR aspect, there's the record-keeping, there's the justification for keeping records, there's the right of the employee in relation to deletion and erasure of their information also if they request it.

Lindsay will probably keep us right here, but you could see a bit of flux happening there. You could see maybe something that does put their head above the parapet, makes that first step, and then recoils back in again because of coercive behaviour that happens. That can be a very difficult matter for an employer and particularly an HR individual to deal with.

The important point would be also, then, that the HR person, the manager doesn't feel that they are the only one dealing with it and that they end up feeling isolated as well.

Lindsay had spoken earlier on just about making sure that you are bringing in the other relevant organisations, that you're a piece in the jigsaw. You're not the entire picture in relation to dealing with it.

I think it is around those trust issues, but it has to be always about open communication with your employee and making sure that they're clear about what your job is, what you have to do, and also taking on board their position and where they're at.

And there may be circumstances where an employee will say, "Look, if you tell anybody this, I'll not be back. I'll leave", and all of that. I suppose that puts the HR individual in a really difficult position. But I think if you have that open communication, you're able to explain and discuss.

As regards your record-keeping, I think it's talking about GDPR and things like that. Give your employee the assurance that if there are notes going to be retained, they are going to be retained confidentially. They'll be kept in digital form that they will be password-protected. There will be limited people with access to that information, and that the organisation will only retain the information for as long as they require it.

I don't think that you could give an automatic answer, particularly if there's legal proceedings end up being involved between the perpetrator and the employee. You might end up having to provide evidence and things like that if there were charges brought and there was a court hearing.

So, you need to sort of be aware of all of that as well. But I think it's just managing it and it's having that respectful relationship in a very difficult, traumatic time. But making sure, I think, that there's an involvement, that it's a two-way street.

Julie: Thanks very much, Seamus. Lindsay, just wanted to ask you a little bit about what employers should not do.

Lindsay: Well, I think we've touched on it. What I would really say is if there is something that can be done much better out there, then you let it be done much better out there.So, we have to be very clear that we are providing a managerial response to domestic abuse. What an employee needs from the workplace is they need to make sure that there's safety, they need to make sure there's understanding, they need to make sure there's confidentiality, and they need to make sure that there's practical support.

So, whenever we look at providing that, we have to focus on that. Really, our role in this is to focus on keeping that individual safe in the workplace. We will work with employers to help them recognise whenever their capacity to keep an employee safe is going to exceed what they can possibly do in the workplace.

As Seamus has outlined, there will be limitations to confidentiality, and it is important that people do know that there are those limitations to confidentiality from the outside through that clear communication. Well, an important thing to understand as well is that whenever we're looking at the approach of employers, it's a trauma-informed approach that we are recommending because you are dealing with people who have experienced trauma.

So, what employers should never do is probe or ask questions or run the risk either of retraumatising that individual or experiencing various traumas themselves. Well-being is a very important thing to look at. Not just the well-being of that individual who's experienced the abuse, but the well-being of the supporter as well. So, whenever we're talking about policy, we would encourage a network of implementers, really, where you can access support for yourself within the workplace, whether you are disclosing or handling a disclosure.

But I would always recommend, for example, that an employer would debrief. Keep everything anonymous. You don't have to name names. But go to someone and say, "This is a rough idea of the conversation. This is what I have said. Is there anything additional I can say? Is there anything else I can go back?" That person can then either be told, "Well, you could maybe recommend this", or they will be told, "No, you have done everything you possibly can". And that employer can then go home and sleep in their bed that night knowing that there's nothing more they can possibly do.

So that element of well-being and looking after yourself within the workplace is very important as well. What they shouldn't do is they shouldn't give advice. They shouldn't give legal advice. They're not counsellors. Again, those are the skills and the skillsets of people who do this on the daily out there. So, they should recognise whenever they do need to signpost on, and that's a very important part.

A very important part of what employers have to do is let go to a certain extent. And I fully appreciate where Seamus is coming from saying about there may be times whenever we do have to . . . where there are those limitations of confidentiality. The way I would look at that is you're saying to your employee, "This goes beyond what I can do to keep you safe, and I want to widen the support network around you here". So that's why we may have to go to our safeguarding policies, or we may have to involve someone else, external experts, in regard to keeping them safe. But it is always with that in mind.

Julie: All right. Sorry. Thanks, Lindsay. I'm sorry to cut you off there, but we're actually out of time. That was a really good discussion for everybody. So, I think what we've mentioned is really about your policies, making sure that it's inclusive, and making sure that you include men, not assuming that partners are of a certain gender either, whenever you're writing your policies.

Just want to give a shout out to the Labour Relations Agency. They're actually having a panel discussion on 24 July about domestic abuse, and it's from an LGBTQIA+ perspective. So, thanks for letting us know about that. Again, you can go to their website to find out a little bit more about that. I think we've talked about policy. We've talked about awareness. So, as I've said, Legal-Island is launching their awareness training. And then for more specialist support, of course, there's other guidance and there are other organisations that can certainly help as well.

And then as Seamus said, we all need to keep an eye on the legislative landscape as well. So, Gosia, if I can just ask you to bring up our last couple of slides. I just want to thank everybody very much for talking with us today, especially Lindsay and Seamus.

Lindsay, those are your contact details if anybody wants to get in touch with you directly. And I will just say thank you to a couple of the people in the audience who have already contacted us to say thanks for demystifying a difficult topic and also treating it with sensitivity as well. So, thank you both very much.

I hope that whatever everybody is up to this afternoon, you have a great weekend as well. I'd just like to give a shout-out to Gosia. This was her first webinar support and she's done a fantastic job. So, thanks, Gosia, for all your help as well. As for everybody else, Employment Law at 11 will be back next month with a different topic, and Seamus and Christine will be putting the world to right. Again, thanks very much, everybody, for joining us. Remember about that eLearning training as well.

And if you're not connected with Legal-Island on LinkedIn or with Seamus or with Lindsay, again, give us a like, and get in contact and connect with us so that we can all keep up with each other and support each other as well.

All right. Thanks very much, everyone.

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This article is correct at 09/07/2024
Disclaimer:

The information in this article is provided as part of Legal-Island's Employment Law Hub. We regret we are not able to respond to requests for specific legal or HR queries and recommend that professional advice is obtained before relying on information supplied anywhere within this article.

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